Griffith's Gnat---trimmed hackle

Today, I trimmed the Griffith's Gnat hackle a little bit to make the
hackle length is about 1.5 times hook gap. Here is the picture.
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dan.versacorp.cn/Forum02

I have to say I do not have the genetic hackle to tie the fly. I use
the smallest Chinese rooster neck feather to tie the fly. And I also
reduce the wrap of peacock herl. The pattern looks a little weird. I
just want to know whether it looks better than my first one. Or there
is anything I should pay attention to when tying this pattern again.

Da wrote:
Today, I trimmed the Griffith's Gnat hackle a little bit to make the
hackle length is about 1.5 times hook gap. Here is the picture.
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dan.versacorp.cn/Forum02

I have to say I do not have the genetic hackle to tie the fly. I use
the smallest Chinese rooster neck feather to tie the fly. And I also
reduce the wrap of peacock herl. The pattern looks a little weird. I
just want to know whether it looks better than my first one. Or there
is anything I should pay attention to when tying this pattern again.

Hello Da:

If you use Google Images to search for "Griffith's Gnat"
you will many photos that look a lot like your trimmed version.

But you can tell (just by looking at your photo) that you trimmed
the hackle before winding it. Trimmed hackles have thick,
square-ended fibers, rather than fibers that taper to a fine
point.

"Da" wrote in message
ups.com...
Today, I trimmed the Griffith's Gnat hackle a little bit to make the
hackle length is about 1.5 times hook gap. Here is the picture.
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dan.versacorp.cn/Forum02

I have to say I do not have the genetic hackle to tie the fly. I use
the smallest Chinese rooster neck feather to tie the fly. And I also
reduce the wrap of peacock herl. The pattern looks a little weird. I
just want to know whether it looks better than my first one. Or there
is anything I should pay attention to when tying this pattern again.

I again urge you to read some books about flyfishing and fly fishing theory
before just trying to copy flies from pictures in flytying books, You need
to understand that somewhat similar apperance does not equal similar
performance or function. For instance, trimming the hackles may give a
somewhat similar appearance (to the human eye at least) to a proper
Griffith's Gnat ( though the overall fly is still several sizes larger than
it should be). but the thick blunt tips of a trimmed hackle will not ride
properly on the surface, will appear wrong to the fish, and will quickly
absorb water and sink.
Even if "genetic" hackles are not available to you in China, you can -
though with some difficulty - find hackles of the proper size. You just
need to be more diligent in your search. A few can usually be found near
the head of good rooster skins. Many of the fly patterns (including
Griffith's Gnat) you are trying to copy originated long before "genetic"
hackle was developed, and several of us on this board are old enough that we
sucessfully tied such patterns for many years before we could get - or
afford - "genetic" hackle.

Bob Weinberger La Grande, OR

Hello Da:

If you use Google Images to search for "Griffith's Gnat"
you will many photos that look a lot like your trimmed version.

But you can tell (just by looking at your photo) that you trimmed
the hackle before winding it. Trimmed hackles have thick,
square-ended fibers, rather than fibers that taper to a fine
point.

Thank you for you comments. I have to say I trimmed the hackle after
winding it up.

I again urge you to read some books about flyfishing and fly fishing theory
before just trying to copy flies from pictures in flytying books, You need
to understand that somewhat similar apperance does not equal similar
performance or function. For instance, trimming the hackles may give a
somewhat similar appearance (to the human eye at least) to a proper
Griffith's Gnat ( though the overall fly is still several sizes larger than
it should be). but the thick blunt tips of a trimmed hackle will not ride
properly on the surface, will appear wrong to the fish, and will quickly
absorb water and sink.
Even if "genetic" hackles are not available to you in China, you can -
though with some difficulty - find hackles of the proper size. You just
need to be more diligent in your search. A few can usually be found near
the head of good rooster skins. Many of the fly patterns (including
Griffith's Gnat) you are trying to copy originated long before "genetic"
hackle was developed, and several of us on this board are old enough that we
sucessfully tied such patterns for many years before we could get - or
afford - "genetic" hackle.

Bob Weinberger La Grande, OR

I understand your point. Next time I will use the right hook for the
right pattern. You know, even you can read a lot of books, if you do
not try to tie it you can not completely understand it. It is the
reason i tie those flies and post them on this forum. I think I have
to get through it by the following processures:
1. get a general idea about fly fishing and fly tying
2. tie some flies to test myself whether i have understood the theory
or pattern in the books
3. post it and read comments to recheck my understandings about fly
fishing and fly tying
4. redo the pattern
5. receive the comments again
6. then i can have a relatively clear mind to know what to do and how
to do
You know, there are few issues which never mentioned in the books like
how many wrap of hackle should be for a pattern. If you wrap too much
some one will say that you have overdressed the pattern. If you wrap
too small, the pattern will not sit on the water as it should be(I
sometimes put the fly on the water to test whether it will sink or
not). All those hints you can only find them when tying them because
it is not math and it does not have clear rules. Copy pattern is only
the first step to get to know more about it. It is, what i think, i
should do. As a Chinese mailand guy, i do not have the fly tying
circumstance around me, it is another reason i have to post my
patterns in this forum to receive your guys comments. Fly pattern is
not only a commercial products, but also a representation of culture
for me. i can feel the connection between human and natural. i hope i
could completely understand it before being buried into the ground.

Bob Weinberger wrote:
"Da" wrote in message
ups.com...
Today, I trimmed the Griffith's Gnat hackle a little bit to make the
hackle length is about 1.5 times hook gap. Here is the picture.
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dan.versacorp.cn/Forum02

I have to say I do not have the genetic hackle to tie the fly. I use
the smallest Chinese rooster neck feather to tie the fly. And I also
reduce the wrap of peacock herl. The pattern looks a little weird. I
just want to know whether it looks better than my first one. Or there
is anything I should pay attention to when tying this pattern again.

I again urge you to read some books about flyfishing and fly fishing theory
before just trying to copy flies from pictures in flytying books, You need
to understand that somewhat similar apperance does not equal similar
performance or function. For instance, trimming the hackles may give a
somewhat similar appearance (to the human eye at least) to a proper
Griffith's Gnat ( though the overall fly is still several sizes larger than
it should be). but the thick blunt tips of a trimmed hackle will not ride
properly on the surface, will appear wrong to the fish, and will quickly
absorb water and sink.
Even if "genetic" hackles are not available to you in China, you can -
though with some difficulty - find hackles of the proper size. You just
need to be more diligent in your search. A few can usually be found near
the head of good rooster skins. Many of the fly patterns (including
Griffith's Gnat) you are trying to copy originated long before "genetic"
hackle was developed, and several of us on this board are old enough that we
sucessfully tied such patterns for many years before we could get - or
afford - "genetic" hackle.

Bob Weinberger La Grande, OR



FWIW, I tie a lot of my GGs with "genetic" hen hackle, which is a little softer and they fish very
well on calm waters. Good "non-genetic" rooster should be at least as good if you follow the
suggestion above and find the right size hackle for the hook.

Vaughan

Da wrote:
Today, I trimmed the Griffith's Gnat hackle a little bit to make the
hackle length is about 1.5 times hook gap. Here is the picture.
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dan.versacorp.cn/Forum02

I have to say I do not have the genetic hackle to tie the fly. I use
the smallest Chinese rooster neck feather to tie the fly. And I also
reduce the wrap of peacock herl. The pattern looks a little weird. I
just want to know whether it looks better than my first one. Or there
is anything I should pay attention to when tying this pattern again.


I would like to apologize, Da, for my previous rude comment on your
original post.
Like some others, I thought it might have been spam, but it wasn't.

I applaud your efforts to create trout files in a situation that makes
it difficult to
find proper materials.

Do you have trout and midges in China? Do you fish for trout?

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

"Da" wrote in message
ups.com...

I have to say I do not have the genetic hackle to tie the fly. I use
the smallest Chinese rooster neck feather to tie the fly. And I also
reduce the wrap of peacock herl. The pattern looks a little weird. I
just want to know whether it looks better than my first one. Or there
is anything I should pay attention to when tying this pattern again.

Apparently you have some history here I'm not aware of. Don't know if
you're on a tight budget, or what. But if you're really into fly tying, you
might want to get "The Fly Tier's Benchside Reference". Awesome reference.

Don't know if
you're on a tight budget, or what. But if you're really into fly tying, you
might want to get "The Fly Tier's Benchside Reference". Awesome reference.

Thank you for your kind advise. I have bought 7 books from USA. The
favorite books are "The benchside Introduction To Fly Tying" by Leeson
Schollmeyer and "Fish Flies-The Encyclopedia of the Fly Tier's Art" By
Terry Hellekson. One book have detailed information about fly tying.
The other book tell more about fly tying history and what is a fly. I
think I have learnd a lot from the books. You know, there is a movie
called " A big river runs through it". I have watched the movie many
times. I love the movie.

By the way, I am not on a tight budget. The reason is none of the
internet shop would like to sent the tying material overseas because
the regulations of several U.S. government agencies. I also asked
China Import and Export Inspection department. The feathers are
forbiden to import unless you have to apply a lot of inspections. So
It is impossible for an individual to buy the feathers on the
internet.

I think I will buy the book "The Fly Tier's Benchside Reference".
However, thanks, guys. I really appreciate it.

Da wrote:
Don't know if

you're on a tight budget, or what. But if you're really into fly tying, you
might want to get "The Fly Tier's Benchside Reference". Awesome reference.


Thank you for your kind advise. I have bought 7 books from USA. The
favorite books are "The benchside Introduction To Fly Tying" by Leeson
Schollmeyer and "Fish Flies-The Encyclopedia of the Fly Tier's Art" By
Terry Hellekson. One book have detailed information about fly tying.
The other book tell more about fly tying history and what is a fly. I
think I have learnd a lot from the books. You know, there is a movie
called " A big river runs through it". I have watched the movie many
times. I love the movie.

Uh oh.


By the way, I am not on a tight budget. The reason is none of the
internet shop would like to sent the tying material overseas because
the regulations of several U.S. government agencies. I also asked
China Import and Export Inspection department. The feathers are
forbiden to import unless you have to apply a lot of inspections. So
It is impossible for an individual to buy the feathers on the
internet.

Just wait. In a few years we'll be buying all our genetic hackle from China.

Maybe you should consider breeding chickens.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.