Spring Creek Trout Fishing in USA

I am considering a fly fishing holiday in the USA. Could somebody from
our USA trout fishing brethren direct me to some quality value for
money fishing in the good ole US of A. I am particularly interested
in small stream fishing (spring creeks?), stalking etc for wild
species preferably using the dry fly. I would also appreciate any
general info on effective fly patterns and associated entomology for
the USA.

Kind Regards

Paul J.
Kilbirnie
Scotland

Paul we need more to work with.

Holiday - how many days to fish or how much $ to spend fishing?
Quality value for money - how do you define?
Small stream fishing(spring creeks) - why small streams?
Do you want to only catch small trout?
Why fish for wild trout?
Why prefer the dry fly?

What are your trade-offs?
Would you trade a wet fly for a 7 pound trout (steelhead)?
Would you trade a U.S. Wilderness area mountain stream dry fly-caught Golden
trout for a spring creek hatchery trout?
Would you trade a guide and caught fish with stalking and maybe fish?
Do you want to stick to the East or is it OK to come West.

Good luck!
John



"merlin" wrote in message
om...
I am considering a fly fishing holiday in the USA. Could somebody from
our USA trout fishing brethren direct me to some quality value for
money fishing in the good ole US of A. I am particularly interested
in small stream fishing (spring creeks?), stalking etc for wild
species preferably using the dry fly. I would also appreciate any
general info on effective fly patterns and associated entomology for
the USA.

Kind Regards

Paul J.
Kilbirnie
Scotland

"bassrecord" wrote in message ...
Paul we need more to work with.

Holiday - how many days to fish or how much $ to spend fishing?

Reckoning on one week duration, i recognise that this is a pitiful
period time to get a true feel for fishing in the USA, however due to
domestic and job responsibilities its about the longest I can be away
at any one stretch, I might be able to push to two weeks with an
appreciable amount of persuasion in certain quarters.

Quality value for money - how do you define?

I would want to be paying no more than £5 to £20 per day for fishing
obviously accommodation would be on top of this, although I would
probably opt to camp. Would expect the water to have a good head of
fish in it and to have a good prospect of regular activity.

Small stream fishing(spring creeks) - why small streams?

I just prefer the intimacy of smaller waters. Also in the context of
a short duration holiday probably unguided, its easier to get to grips
with a small water.

Do you want to only catch small trout?

Most cerainly not, some of the biggest trout I have caught have been
out of small streams (no more than 20 to 30ft across and sometimes
much less). However size is not the overriding factor, the hunt is
just as important.

Why fish for wild trout?

Again this is just my preference. Although to tell the truth I guess
there aint much difference between an overwintered stockie and the
truly wild stock of the water. I guess my preference for wild trout
fishing is mainly borne out of the 'put and take' fishery brigade
which is so much a part of modern fisheries.

Why prefer the dry fly?

I just prefer this technique, it holds more fascination for me than
wet fly or nymphing, although nymph fishing does come a close 2nd.


What are your trade-offs?
Would you trade a wet fly for a 7 pound trout (steelhead)?
Would you trade a U.S. Wilderness area mountain stream dry fly-caught Golden
trout for a spring creek hatchery trout?
Would you trade a guide and caught fish with stalking and maybe fish?

Most definitely a wilderness fisherman by preference.

Although there is a level of anticipation when fishing with a guide,
in that you are more or less guaranteed to catch (conditions
prevailing of course), there is a mystery about being on an unknown
water and I feel a greater level of anticipation. Of course by the
end of the day that anticipation could wind up turning into sheer
depression as you log yet another blank day, due to not knowing the
correct patterns to fish, or where to look, but then that's all part
of the 'art of fishing for trout with the fly'. If I wanted to just
catch fish I'd drop off at the nearest 'put and take' fishery and lob
lures on lead core lines with the rest of the stockie bashing brigade.

As to Guides specifically, I am not sure of the price involved,
perhaps you could provide some background here.

Do you want to stick to the East or is it OK to come West.

Location doesn't really matter. Although I have been reading up on
the Spring Creek fishing in and around Wisconsin and Iowa with real
interest. The main reason for this interest is that fishing the
equivalent over here (chalkstreams in southern England) is a rather
expensive prospect, anywhere between £50 to £250 per day and at the
moment anyway my wallet does not stretch that far. The Spring Creek
environment would also be a change from my normal fair which is
Scottish spate rivers ('free stone' I believe would be your
terminology).

Kind Regards

Paul.

Paul,
Thanks for providing more details. See below @@@
"merlin" wrote in message
om...
"bassrecord" wrote in message
...
Paul we need more to work with.

Holiday - how many days to fish or how much $ to spend fishing?

Reckoning on one week duration, i recognise that this is a pitiful
period time to get a true feel for fishing in the USA, however due to
domestic and job responsibilities its about the longest I can be away
at any one stretch, I might be able to push to two weeks with an
appreciable amount of persuasion in certain quarters.
@@@ The shorter your air flight, the more fishing time and the cheaper it
will be. This means East coast or Canada's Maritime Provinces.

Quality value for money - how do you define?

I would want to be paying no more than £5 to £20 per day for fishing
obviously accommodation would be on top of this, although I would
probably opt to camp. Would expect the water to have a good head of
fish in it and to have a good prospect of regular activity.
@@@ To get away from people, i. e. "wild" fish you'll have to fly West or
North from your East coast arrival airport, get to a destination city and
rent a car and drive or a fish camp pick you up at the airport. Many fish
camps or lodges offer non-guided fishing where they drop you off and pick
you up

Small stream fishing(spring creeks) - why small streams?

I just prefer the intimacy of smaller waters. Also in the context of
a short duration holiday probably unguided, its easier to get to grips
with a small water.

Do you want to only catch small trout?

Most cerainly not, some of the biggest trout I have caught have been
out of small streams (no more than 20 to 30ft across and sometimes
much less). However size is not the overriding factor, the hunt is
just as important.

Why fish for wild trout?

Again this is just my preference. Although to tell the truth I guess
there aint much difference between an overwintered stockie and the
truly wild stock of the water. I guess my preference for wild trout
fishing is mainly borne out of the 'put and take' fishery brigade
which is so much a part of modern fisheries.

Why prefer the dry fly?

I just prefer this technique, it holds more fascination for me than
wet fly or nymphing, although nymph fishing does come a close 2nd.


What are your trade-offs?
Would you trade a wet fly for a 7 pound trout (steelhead)?
Would you trade a U.S. Wilderness area mountain stream dry fly-caught
Golden
trout for a spring creek hatchery trout?
Would you trade a guide and caught fish with stalking and maybe fish?

Most definitely a wilderness fisherman by preference.

Although there is a level of anticipation when fishing with a guide,
in that you are more or less guaranteed to catch (conditions
prevailing of course), there is a mystery about being on an unknown
water and I feel a greater level of anticipation. Of course by the
end of the day that anticipation could wind up turning into sheer
depression as you log yet another blank day, due to not knowing the
correct patterns to fish, or where to look, but then that's all part
of the 'art of fishing for trout with the fly'. If I wanted to just
catch fish I'd drop off at the nearest 'put and take' fishery and lob
lures on lead core lines with the rest of the stockie bashing brigade.

As to Guides specifically, I am not sure of the price involved,
perhaps you could provide some background here.

Do you want to stick to the East or is it OK to come West.

Location doesn't really matter. Although I have been reading up on
the Spring Creek fishing in and around Wisconsin and Iowa with real
interest. The main reason for this interest is that fishing the
equivalent over here (chalkstreams in southern England) is a rather
expensive prospect, anywhere between £50 to £250 per day and at the
moment anyway my wallet does not stretch that far. The Spring Creek
environment would also be a change from my normal fair which is
Scottish spate rivers ('free stone' I believe would be your
terminology).
@@@ Paul I sense a high probability of disappointment in your trip. Driving
along and fishing a spring creek in some state after flying all the way over
here may or may not work out for you. Why risk it? Why not lock in success
before you come over here?

In the U.S. we have Wilderness Areas usually in or near National Forests
that exclude entry via motorized vehicles. Outfitters and pack stations via
horses pack fishermen into these areas, drop them off and come back and pick
them up 4 to 7 days later. Fishermen can camp in cabins or pre-pitched
tents, do their own cooking and hike to nearby fishng waters. Canada has
similar facilities in or near Provincial Parks. My son and I did this
several years ago for Golden Trout in the Golden Trout Wilderness area near
Kennedy Meadows in California's upper Kearn River plateau. See
http://www.kennedymeadows.com/ for an example.

Maine, Vermont and Pennsylvania have wilderness areas, see
http://gorp.away.com/gorp/resource/U..._Area/main.htm

Hope this gets you started.

Good luck!

John

Paul,
Two additional sources for you. Trout Unlimited (TU) and Federation Of Fly
Fishers (FFF) clubs and local chapters may have fish outs heading to
Wilderness Areas and other areas which meet your needs and you may be able
to invite your self to come along.

Good luck!
John

"merlin" wrote in message
om...
"bassrecord" wrote in message
...
Paul we need more to work with.

Holiday - how many days to fish or how much $ to spend fishing?

Reckoning on one week duration, i recognise that this is a pitiful
period time to get a true feel for fishing in the USA, however due to
domestic and job responsibilities its about the longest I can be away
at any one stretch, I might be able to push to two weeks with an
appreciable amount of persuasion in certain quarters.

As amatter of fact, a week is a pitiful period of time to get a true feel
for any one of a staggering number of single counties in any number of
states in the USA.

Quality value for money - how do you define?

I would want to be paying no more than £5 to £20 per day for fishing
obviously accommodation would be on top of this, although I would
probably opt to camp. Would expect the water to have a good head of
fish in it and to have a good prospect of regular activity.

I don't know what the exchange rate is, but 40-60 $US will buy you unlimited
fishing for a year on public water in most states. Private waters (in those
states where such exist) will require additional fees or permits but one can
avoid them in ALL states and still have more than a lifetime's supply of
excellent fisheries with good populations of fish.

Location doesn't really matter. Although I have been reading up on
the Spring Creek fishing in and around Wisconsin and Iowa with real
interest. The main reason for this interest is that fishing the
equivalent over here (chalkstreams in southern England) is a rather
expensive prospect, anywhere between £50 to £250 per day and at the
moment anyway my wallet does not stretch that far. The Spring Creek
environment would also be a change from my normal fair which is
Scottish spate rivers ('free stone' I believe would be your
terminology).

Interesting that someone in close proximity to the fabled chalk streams of
England should be looking at our own humble offerings. Like you, I've spent
a great deal more time on the free stone streams.....and I much prefer them.
That said, the spring/limestone/chalk streams of southwestern Wisconsin have
enjoyed an amazing resurgence in the last couple of decades. They are home
to an incredible number of fish.....and BIG fish. Not surprisingly, they
have also become very popular. Nevertheless, you will find easy access to a
lot of good water without excessive competition from other fishers if you do
a bit of research and drive around a bit. You shouldn't have any trouble
finding numerous resources on the web, but feel free to email me if you need
any specific information. I'm not as familiar with the area as some, but I
should be able to help a bit. In the meantime, the Wisconsin Department of
Natural Resources is a good place to start for information on which
watersheds have trout in them. They publish maps of the entire state with
the trout streams highlighted. It is available at:

http://dnr.wi.gov/org/water/fhp/fish...utsalmon.shtml

The vast bulk of the spring streams are in the southwestern third or so of
the state. Particularly noteworthy are the watersheds of the Kinnickinnic,
Rush, Willow, Kickapoo, and Timber Coulee. There are many other excellent
streams but, as stated, I don't know all that much about them.

Good luck.

Wolfgang





Kind Regards

Paul.

for clarification, 40 to 60 dollars is for a year in that particular state.

Each state will sell you a license for a week or so for oh, 15 dollars.

Do you guys have smallmouth bass over there?

john

"Wolfgang" wrote in message
...

"merlin" wrote in message
om...
"bassrecord" wrote in message
...
Paul we need more to work with.

Holiday - how many days to fish or how much $ to spend fishing?

Reckoning on one week duration, i recognise that this is a pitiful
period time to get a true feel for fishing in the USA, however due to
domestic and job responsibilities its about the longest I can be away
at any one stretch, I might be able to push to two weeks with an
appreciable amount of persuasion in certain quarters.

As amatter of fact, a week is a pitiful period of time to get a true feel
for any one of a staggering number of single counties in any number of
states in the USA.

Quality value for money - how do you define?

I would want to be paying no more than £5 to £20 per day for fishing
obviously accommodation would be on top of this, although I would
probably opt to camp. Would expect the water to have a good head of
fish in it and to have a good prospect of regular activity.

I don't know what the exchange rate is, but 40-60 $US will buy you
unlimited
fishing for a year on public water in most states. Private waters (in
those
states where such exist) will require additional fees or permits but one
can
avoid them in ALL states and still have more than a lifetime's supply of
excellent fisheries with good populations of fish.

Location doesn't really matter. Although I have been reading up on
the Spring Creek fishing in and around Wisconsin and Iowa with real
interest. The main reason for this interest is that fishing the
equivalent over here (chalkstreams in southern England) is a rather
expensive prospect, anywhere between £50 to £250 per day and at the
moment anyway my wallet does not stretch that far. The Spring Creek
environment would also be a change from my normal fair which is
Scottish spate rivers ('free stone' I believe would be your
terminology).

Interesting that someone in close proximity to the fabled chalk streams of
England should be looking at our own humble offerings. Like you, I've
spent
a great deal more time on the free stone streams.....and I much prefer
them.
That said, the spring/limestone/chalk streams of southwestern Wisconsin
have
enjoyed an amazing resurgence in the last couple of decades. They are
home
to an incredible number of fish.....and BIG fish. Not surprisingly, they
have also become very popular. Nevertheless, you will find easy access to
a
lot of good water without excessive competition from other fishers if you
do
a bit of research and drive around a bit. You shouldn't have any trouble
finding numerous resources on the web, but feel free to email me if you
need
any specific information. I'm not as familiar with the area as some, but
I
should be able to help a bit. In the meantime, the Wisconsin Department
of
Natural Resources is a good place to start for information on which
watersheds have trout in them. They publish maps of the entire state with
the trout streams highlighted. It is available at:

http://dnr.wi.gov/org/water/fhp/fish...utsalmon.shtml

The vast bulk of the spring streams are in the southwestern third or so of
the state. Particularly noteworthy are the watersheds of the
Kinnickinnic,
Rush, Willow, Kickapoo, and Timber Coulee. There are many other
excellent
streams but, as stated, I don't know all that much about them.

Good luck.

Wolfgang





Kind Regards

Paul.

merlin wrote:

I am considering a fly fishing holiday in the USA. Could somebody from
our USA trout fishing brethren direct me to some quality value for
money fishing in the good sole US of A. I am particularly interested
in small stream fishing (spring creeks?), stalking etc for wild
species preferably using the dry fly. I would also appreciate any
general info on effective fly patterns and associated entomology for
the USA.

Kind Regards

Paul J.
Kilbirnie
Scotland

The States are a very big place (The US is more than 100 times the size
of Scotland) and recommendations would depend on what part of the US you
would like to visit ie West Coast, the Rockies, the East etc. The vast
majority of our waters in the US are publicly owned and the only fee
is a fishing license from the State where you will be fishing. Most
States offer one day, three day, one week and annual licenses. The
fees are very inexpensive and allow you to fish any public waters in the
State. There are many, many miles of publicly owned streams and rivers
with wild trout in the US. My State, Colorado has over 9000 of
publicly owned miles of streams and rivers. Spring Creeks are much
less common and many of them are privately held.

Willi

.....publicly owned miles of streams and rivers. Spring Creeks are much
less common and many of them are privately held.

For the privately held waters are they open to visitors at all? Do
you have to pay a fee for a day ticket such as I would have to do in
the UK, or is it simply a case of asking permission from the land
owner?

Paul.

Two states immediately come to my mind wrt spring creeks: Montana and
Idaho.